Elevated Liver Enzymes on SARMS

[Maverick602]

Hey bros...I was waxing and waning on which specific cycle to start, but I got antsy and started carnadine 20mg/day and ostarine 50mg/day and I am 3 weeks and my doc ran routine blood work and my liver enzymes came back a tad high.

I was not running anything for organ support because by what nearly every person said on the board, both compounds are NOT toxic to the liver.

However, I beg to differ. Now I started a liver detox serum because I had it on hand and I just ordered TUDCA, milk thistle, NAC, zinc and vitamin D.

I never had liver issues and I have a baseline below from 5 months ago and tests this week.

5 months ago
ALT 32
AST 18

This week
ALT - 56
AST 55

They are not terribly high, but higher than they should be.

Share your thoughts when you can. Thanks.

 

[starboy]

Hey bros...I was waxing and waning on which specific cycle to start, but I got antsy and started carnadine 20mg/day and ostarine 50mg/day and I am 3 weeks and my doc ran routine blood work and my liver enzymes came back a tad high.

I was not running anything for organ support because by what nearly every person said on the board, both compounds are NOT toxic to the liver.

However, I beg to differ. Now I started a liver detox serum because I had it on hand and I just ordered TUDCA, milk thistle, NAC, zinc and vitamin D.

I never had liver issues and I have a baseline below from 5 months ago and tests this week.

5 months ago
ALT 32
AST 18

This week
ALT - 56
AST 55

They are not terribly high, but higher than they should be.

Share your thoughts when you can. Thanks.

You can have a boost in liver enzymes from sarms but also from stress and training.

That's why I always suggest using N2Guard with sarms, but since n2guard out of stock for a few weeks more, Go with the TUDCA/milk thistle/NAC mix for now.

 

[CEO]

bros thats why you gotta use n2guard on sarms

 

[ROIDDERS]

use n2guard and you never have this issues imo

 

[QuadSweep]

you didnt use organ support
but you on a cycle and not sharing your cycle log?

 

[Ulter]

yea Mav I thought you were doing a Log journal for us is that happening?

 

[e2]

you should have used n2guard

 

[2Thick]

are you planning to do a new Log? I loved the last one

 

[Vadim Fedorov]

I had the same issue on sarms, got n2guard all problems solved

 

[MONSTRO]

lack of n2guard is the problem imo
when is your new journal log going up?

 

[StevenDarwinMD]

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[dylangemelli]

bro, you can be to differ just fine.. thats your call.. .sarms are not c17 alpha alkylated and not toxic aside from yk11, which i have mentioned several times, containing slight methylation... this is fact, not just nonsense or heresay... my liver enzymes for instance, stay elevated from stress from the amount of working out... ive never once personally had elevated enzymes from sarms use and have been at this over a decade with them and have seen it with it some, SLIGHTLY , but often times its with the hardcore workout people or the people with extreme diets etc... your acting as though you are in a range of a steroid user etc... your numbers are not alarming in any way and ANY doctor would tell you that...

also.... i have had blood work done now three times on myself in the past 4 months because i had high liver and kidney numbers... this is while using NOTHING aside from my normal trt... they fluctuate nonstop.. perfectly healthy liver and kidneys, and thats after ultrasounds and other testing done just to be sure... this is common and normal... you have done this before with mk677, where you just had very sensitive reactions.. some people have that as well...

so its fine when its of concern or of question, thats why you ask questions but to insinuate these are toxic is completely false...

i have always told everyone, NO MATTER WHAT YOU ARE USING, to always protect your organs regardless because WE ALL RESPOND DIFFERENTLY AND ITS JUST WISE TO ALWAYS PROTECT YOURSELF... im the guy that tells everyone, even if they are not running ANY compounds that convert to estrogen, to always have an AI on hand regardless... structurally, scientifically, however you want to look at it, we ALL have different reactions that cannot be explained by any type of "science" etc... thats how this all works.. its ALL trial and error as you learn YOUR body... i can give you facts over facts over a million other facts, studies etc.. and that is great as a reference but ultimately, it means jack in the long run if YOU respond a certain way... you could be 1 out of a million but there is always that one or two or small portion that is always sensitive to outside stimuli or that just respond differently than others... ive literally seen it all... ive been coaching steroid users for over a decade... ive seen the strangest, oddest scenarios you could imagine so i get it.. .this is why bloodwork is so important but right now your numbers are so far from alarming...

 

[Mobster]

I'd argue that you ALWAYS need organ protection.

Who was your source?

 

[Maverick602]

You can have a boost in liver enzymes from sarms but also from stress and training.

That's why I always suggest using N2Guard with sarms, but since n2guard out of stock for a few weeks more, Go with the TUDCA/milk thistle/NAC mix for now.

Thanks bro...always great advice.

 

[Maverick602]

bro, you can be to differ just fine.. thats your call.. .sarms are not c17 alpha alkylated and not toxic aside from yk11, which i have mentioned several times, containing slight methylation... this is fact, not just nonsense or heresay... my liver enzymes for instance, stay elevated from stress from the amount of working out... ive never once personally had elevated enzymes from sarms use and have been at this over a decade with them and have seen it with it some, SLIGHTLY , but often times its with the hardcore workout people or the people with extreme diets etc... your acting as though you are in a range of a steroid user etc... your numbers are not alarming in any way and ANY doctor would tell you that...

also.... i have had blood work done now three times on myself in the past 4 months because i had high liver and kidney numbers... this is while using NOTHING aside from my normal trt... they fluctuate nonstop.. perfectly healthy liver and kidneys, and thats after ultrasounds and other testing done just to be sure... this is common and normal... you have done this before with mk677, where you just had very sensitive reactions.. some people have that as well...

so its fine when its of concern or of question, thats why you ask questions but to insinuate these are toxic is completely false...

i have always told everyone, NO MATTER WHAT YOU ARE USING, to always protect your organs regardless because WE ALL RESPOND DIFFERENTLY AND ITS JUST WISE TO ALWAYS PROTECT YOURSELF... im the guy that tells everyone, even if they are not running ANY compounds that convert to estrogen, to always have an AI on hand regardless... structurally, scientifically, however you want to look at it, we ALL have different reactions that cannot be explained by any type of "science" etc... thats how this all works.. its ALL trial and error as you learn YOUR body... i can give you facts over facts over a million other facts, studies etc.. and that is great as a reference but ultimately, it means jack in the long run if YOU respond a certain way... you could be 1 out of a million but there is always that one or two or small portion that is always sensitive to outside stimuli or that just respond differently than others... ive literally seen it all... ive been coaching steroid users for over a decade... ive seen the strangest, oddest scenarios you could imagine so i get it.. .this is why bloodwork is so important but right now your numbers are so far from alarming...

Thanks for the thorough response bro.

Before I posted this, I did a search on liver related SARMS threads and read a lot of bros talking in absolutes. "SARMS don't hurt your liver", "SARMS are not toxic", "if your values are up, you must have purchased shit gear from a non-approved source", etc.

I knew exactly what I was going to do to lower my levels and was not fishing for answers, but I posted like this so younger guys hopefully realize all of our bodies react differently and they need to constantly monitor their bloods and the effects PED's are having on their bodies.

For the record, this is not to criticize the opinions of others. We all have a right to post our opinions and experiences for the good of the collective. (I know you understand where I am coming from.)

I am also owning my screw up here. I should never have started a PED, especially an oral, without organ protection and elevated liver values is what I got for being negligent and lazy.



Overall, I could not agree with you more. Everyone is different and there are no "one size fits all" PED solution.

I have a history of being sensitive to certain compounds, which is good and bad. The positive side is that I need less gear than many guys to see the same results. The negative side is that sometime my side effects are more intense or different than most.

However, I get my liver enzymes tested regularly and this is the first time my enzymes were elevated since I took Dbol 15 years ago. I know, without question, this was not because my body is under stress...I am 95% this was because of he Ostarine and Cardarine. Because I am not a doctor, because I try not to think in absolutes and because I certainly don't know everything, I could be wrong, but I really can't see another explanation.

If it looks like a duck and quacks, it's usually a duck.

Again, as is, my current liver values are nothing to really worry about, but because of the elevation, I need to take action, before it becomes an issue. With the addition of TUDCA, NAC, Milk Thistle, vitamins D and Zinc, the values should drop reasonably soon.

Once I start that supplement regime, I will retest in a few weeks.


Thanks again for your input as always.

 

[Maverick602]

I'd argue that you ALWAYS need organ protection.

Who was your source?

Yeah bro...I fucked up. Lesson learned.

Sarms4Sale

 

[Maverick602]

Not trying to be a dick, but for those of you who responded "you should have used N2Gaurd"...why say this when you know they have been out of stock for 2-3 months??

I reached out to them twice asking for a lead time when it would be in stock and they never responded. Unless you guys know something I don't, which I am sure you do, there is no credible "in stock" end date.

That said, I can't use N2Gaurd at this time....no one can. Just saying

 

[dylangemelli]

Not trying to be a dick, but for those of you who responded "you should have used N2Gaurd"...why say this when you know they have been out of stock for 2-3 months??

I reached out to them twice asking for a lead time when it would be in stock and they never responded. Unless you guys know something I don't, which I am sure you do, there is no credible "in stock" end date.

That said, I can't use N2Gaurd at this time....no one can. Just saying

Im wondering if some dont realize its out of stock... not sure but thats why ive refrained from putting it out there to use until its back... completely understand your point and people need to stay aware of that type of thing before posting... its just not helpful otherwise...

 

[dylangemelli]

Thanks for the thorough response bro.

Before I posted this, I did a search on liver related SARMS threads and read a lot of bros talking in absolutes. "SARMS don't hurt your liver", "SARMS are not toxic", "if your values are up, you must have purchased shit gear from a non-approved source", etc.

I knew exactly what I was going to do to lower my levels and was not fishing for answers, but I posted like this so younger guys hopefully realize all of our bodies react differently and they need to constantly monitor their bloods and the effects PED's are having on their bodies.

For the record, this is not to criticize the opinions of others. We all have a right to post our opinions and experiences for the good of the collective. (I know you understand where I am coming from.)

I am also owning my screw up here. I should never have started a PED, especially an oral, without organ protection and elevated liver values is what I got for being negligent and lazy.



Overall, I could not agree with you more. Everyone is different and there are no "one size fits all" PED solution.

I have a history of being sensitive to certain compounds, which is good and bad. The positive side is that I need less gear than many guys to see the same results. The negative side is that sometime my side effects are more intense or different than most.

However, I get my liver enzymes tested regularly and this is the first time my enzymes were elevated since I took Dbol 15 years ago. I know, without question, this was not because my body is under stress...I am 95% this was because of he Ostarine and Cardarine. Because I am not a doctor, because I try not to think in absolutes and because I certainly don't know everything, I could be wrong, but I really can't see another explanation.

If it looks like a duck and quacks, it's usually a duck.

Again, as is, my current liver values are nothing to really worry about, but because of the elevation, I need to take action, before it becomes an issue. With the addition of TUDCA, NAC, Milk Thistle, vitamins D and Zinc, the values should drop reasonably soon.

Once I start that supplement regime, I will retest in a few weeks.


Thanks again for your input as always.

no problem at all.. i wanted to give a very clear answer instead of a weak recommendation... i want people to read and see and fully understand so i hope it helped and was clear enough for not only you but everyone reading... just as you have been doing, just continue to stay on top of numbers and body responses etc... all you can do is what YOUR body tells you...

 

[Maverick602]

Im wondering if some dont realize its out of stock... not sure but thats why ive refrained from putting it out there to use until its back... completely understand your point and people need to stay aware of that type of thing before posting... its just not helpful otherwise...

Hmmmm good point. Maybe they all bought a case of N2Gaurd and they are eating it like candy with no clue the rest of us are suffering LOL